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Page speed - dnn or theme?

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Posts:57
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    I have been spending considerable time testing and optimizing my home page speed as measured by PageSpeed Insights. I have also used another closely related test by google. with the theme i am evaluating - 3d party - desktop performance is quite good, but mobile performance google rated as poor because it measured load time as 4.1 seconds. so i removed everything from page except the theme and my logo. that got my time down to 3.9 seconds - still poor.

    based upon the suggestions for improvement, my guess is that the theme is sub-optimal rather than dnn per se. i say that because the recommendations are to optimize jss, css, render blocking, unusued javascript, etc, which i associate with the theme. is that a reasonable conclusion?

    if it is, does anyone know of any fast mobile dnn themes? google's definition of fast is 1 second or less. while some people may complain about that as unrealistic, google has great power to make or break websites in its indexing/searching algorithms. and while many may disagree with its stringencies, i suspect that performance plays a part in where website's appear in search results.

    and like it or not, google is heavily biased in favor of mobile computing - that is where it does the bulk of grading. hence my focus on finding fast loading themes.



    Basic Member


    Posts:57
    Basic Member

      i am finding good results with some of the easydnn themes. empty pages on desktop are scoring consistently at 96 and mobile in the 70s - more variation.

      no need to lecture me about performance being a confluence of multitudinous factors, some of which have nothing to do with the software. but where software engineering is a factor, then some themes are going to perform better over others.


      Veteran Member


      Posts:840
      Veteran Member

        If empty pages are performing ok, look to what is on the tabs that don't perform well. For example:

        are your images optimized?
        Any big chunks of HTML?
        Any large files?
        large css or js files?
        Modules that add lost of stuff?

        Finally, which version of DNN and which skin?
        Joe Craig
        DNN MVP
        Patapsco Research Group


        Basic Member


        Posts:57
        Basic Member

          Posted By Joe Craig on 11 Jan 2021 12:06 AM
          If empty pages are performing ok, look to what is on the tabs that don't perform well. For example:

          are your images optimized?
          Any big chunks of HTML?
          Any large files?
          large css or js files?
          Modules that add lost of stuff?

          Finally, which version of DNN and which skin?

          the images may not be text book since they are jpegs - i have one static which is a little under 150kb. no big chunks of html which i have added.

          now that last point gets to the root of the issue especially as related to css and js files. i believe that i mentioned that everything is 3d party, so even if they are large, i am not sure what i could do about it. and i have only one module - revindex - which shows 4 products. but as i said, i stripped the page down to nothing but a logo and a copyright notice and of course the theme.

          i am using dnn 9.8 with dnngo minis theme. the vendor told me that the load time is due to dnn. her position is that she is using highly optimized js and css, saying that dnn uses a lot of js and css. and that there is no way to load a site on mobile within 1 second with even a bare page.

          there are no pat answers. but through trial and error, and cajoling of vendors, i am hoping to see improvements in the mobile space.

           



          Basic Member


          Posts:57
          Basic Member

            Posted By Joe Craig on 11 Jan 2021 12:06 AM
            If empty pages are performing ok, look to what is on the tabs that don't perform well. For example:

            are your images optimized?
            Any big chunks of HTML?
            Any large files?
            large css or js files?
            Modules that add lost of stuff?

            Finally, which version of DNN and which skin?

            the images may not be text book since they are jpegs - i have one static which is a little under 150kb. no big chunks of html which i have added.

            now that last point gets to the root of the issue especially as related to css and js files. i believe that i mentioned that everything is 3d party, so even if they are large, i am not sure what i could do about it. and i have only one module - revindex - which shows 4 products. but as i said, i stripped the page down to nothing but a logo and a copyright notice and of course the theme.

            i am using dnn 9.8 with dnngo minis theme. the vendor told me that the load time is due to dnn. her position is that she is using highly optimized js and css, saying that dnn uses a lot of js and css. and that there is no way to load a site on mobile within 1 second with even a bare page.

            there are no pat answers. but through trial and error, and cajoling of vendors, i am hoping to see improvements in the mobile space.

             



            Veteran Member


            Posts:359
            Veteran Member

              Hi Tony,

              Page speed is not a forte of DNN, that I agree with Linda. Having said that, I get an 82 on mobile and 97 on desktop, using Vanjaro. But you are not on Vanjaro :-) 
              So, what can we do within DNN Mini's context?

              • www.tinypng.com. Yes, it is work, but it is worth it. And you must as Minis does not do webp.
              • In the theme plugin of Minis you can turn off Bootstrap js and CSS3 animations in the Jquery library
              • You can even try to do the same for the css library but that will probably ruin your design/ux
              • In the layouts (also header and footer layouts) you can delete panes. Although, I think officially it shouldn't matter much, it must add up. So, delete what you don't need.
              • Minis loads the css much, much better than older themes. It still loads a lot of stuff you might not need, though. I always do a run down after go live to see what css is not needed. Most of the time, you have 1 effect for a card (appear) and 6 you never use. You can either delete that on the deepest level or on page level. 

              Before you run to Vanjaro, download that and start uninstalling Minis...There are 3 big advantages of using Minis:
              1. It has pretty designs. 
              2. It works really simple for editors
              3. it is not in beta :-) 
              Vanjaro is currently still in beta which means it has its quircks. And actually, some pretty nasty ones too, so if you have a choice, wait at least until RC. But don't forget to take it for a spin as it is really awesome.

              Cheers
              Tycho

              Tjep's digital agencyRegards,
              Tycho de Waard

              Tjep's digital agency
              We just love DNN
              https://www.tjeps.com


              Basic Member


              Posts:57
              Basic Member

                Posted By Tycho de Waard (SU) on 11 Jan 2021 02:28 PM

                Hi Tony,

                Page speed is not a forte of DNN, that I agree with Linda. Having said that, I get an 82 on mobile and 97 on desktop, using Vanjaro. But you are not on Vanjaro :-) 
                So, what can we do within DNN Mini's context?

                • www.tinypng.com. Yes, it is work, but it is worth it. And you must as Minis does not do webp.
                • In the theme plugin of Minis you can turn off Bootstrap js and CSS3 animations in the Jquery library
                • You can even try to do the same for the css library but that will probably ruin your design/ux
                • In the layouts (also header and footer layouts) you can delete panes. Although, I think officially it shouldn't matter much, it must add up. So, delete what you don't need.
                • Minis loads the css much, much better than older themes. It still loads a lot of stuff you might not need, though. I always do a run down after go live to see what css is not needed. Most of the time, you have 1 effect for a card (appear) and 6 you never use. You can either delete that on the deepest level or on page level. 

                Before you run to Vanjaro, download that and start uninstalling Minis...There are 3 big advantages of using Minis:
                1. It has pretty designs. 
                2. It works really simple for editors
                3. it is not in beta :-) 
                Vanjaro is currently still in beta which means it has its quircks. And actually, some pretty nasty ones too, so if you have a choice, wait at least until RC. But don't forget to take it for a spin as it is really awesome.

                Cheers
                Tycho

                you make similar points i made to Linda - i told her that i like minis visually. and there is a high chance i adopt it. i am getting in the 60s, sometimes 50s, with minis, and 90-92 on desktop with my current design which consists of the theme, logo, copyright notice, the static image i mentioned, and 4 dynamics coming from revindex show case. i suspect that i will remove the showcase to use static images although it is a pain to maintain.

                the editors provided by dnngo are very rich and flexible, once you get past the learning curve. so there is a great deal of value in those features.

                there is no quick fix, and as i suspected at the outset, a bit of work is required by theme publishers as well as by dnn to get to class leading performance. for me, this is a journey - there is no quick fix. but i had to ask the questions to see if others had found the holy grail. incidentally, i tested some sites with great graphics which performed piss poor. mailchimp's home page was a disaster when i tested it yesterday. 1 on the mobile, and just a few points higher on the desktop. but it is a great looking home page.

                thanks for the tips on minis!!

                on a final note, when the page loaders point to specific css and js, and render blocking, you know you have an engineering challenge. i will post the recommendations to see if it points to dnn or themes. i am now beginning to think it might be in dnn.

                 



                Basic Member


                Posts:57
                Basic Member

                  @tycho - regarding vanjaro - it is not ready for prime time as you warned. i foolishly disregarded the notice not to install it on a production site. after doing so, i lost the persona bar. after a moment of panic, i removed the vanjaro references in web.config, which restored the persona bar. i wasted no time uninstalling it. i did not think that it would be as invasive as it was to the dnn installation. the login popup also was replaced with something else.

                  any way, i will keep an eye on it. i suspect that it needs 6 - 12 months before it is stable enough for production. in the mean time i will probably go with minis, and try to sweet talk linda into some performance enhancements.
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